people who sink vs. people who float

[H***@hotmail.com]

While on vacation not too long ago, I decided to try to learn to swim
properly. (I currently only know the doggy-paddle stoke which wastes a
great deal of energy.) What surprised me is that my instructor (my
wife) uses basically the same technique as I do. The difference is, she
can float with almost no effort. I can't seem to float no matter how
hard I try. So even though neither of us swims properly, she can easily
swim around the pool without tiring. I take several breaks and am
always out of breath.

So I studied other swimmers and came to the conclusion that there are 3
types of swimmers:
1. Good swimmers. These people use good technique and can probably be
either natural floaters or natural sinkers.
2. Floaters. These people have virtually no technique, yet somehow can
swim with ease and not tire.
3. Sinkers. These people have no technique and can only stay afloat for
minutes at a time before all of their energy is expended.

As a sinker, I do sometimes feel jealous of floaters and good swimmers.
But on the bright side, I know I burn more calories per minute than
either of them.

Does anybody have any explanations for what makes us floaters or
sinkers? Body fat? Bone density? Eye color?

Also, are there any good tips for turning a sinker into a good swimmer?
I'm sure some of you have accomplished this.

[Peabody]

Post by H***@hotmail.com
Does anybody have any explanations for what makes us
floaters or sinkers? Body fat? Bone density? Eye color?

It's primarily finger nail length.

Well, perhaps bodyfat percentage plays a minor role.

Post by H***@hotmail.com
Also, are there any good tips for turning a sinker into
a good swimmer? I'm sure some of you have accomplished
this.

Sufficient forward motion overcomes sinking. Think "lift".
Well, not exactly like lift, but kinda the same result.

Anyway, as you become more fit, and as you improve your
form, everything will fall into place, and one day you will
suddenly realize - you're flying.

[Kinglouis]

Post by Peabody
Sufficient forward motion overcomes sinking.

I don't agree with the above statement: you will be strugeling forever,
maybe you become a very fit strugeler after some time, but swimming
will always be hard work for you.

You must learn to float so that the foreward motion is the only thing
where you need your force. there are different floating drills wich
help you to learn it.

look here for example: http://www.svl.ch/crawl/freestyle.html

As someone else already wrote here: it needs work and patience. I coul
learn it with 38.

[Steve Freides]

Post by H***@hotmail.com
While on vacation not too long ago, I decided to try to learn to swim
properly. (I currently only know the doggy-paddle stoke which wastes a
great deal of energy.) What surprised me is that my instructor (my
wife) uses basically the same technique as I do. The difference is, she
can float with almost no effort. I can't seem to float no matter how
hard I try. So even though neither of us swims properly, she can easily
swim around the pool without tiring. I take several breaks and am
always out of breath.
So I studied other swimmers and came to the conclusion that there are 3
1. Good swimmers. These people use good technique and can probably be
either natural floaters or natural sinkers.
2. Floaters. These people have virtually no technique, yet somehow can
swim with ease and not tire.
3. Sinkers. These people have no technique and can only stay afloat for
minutes at a time before all of their energy is expended.
As a sinker, I do sometimes feel jealous of floaters and good
swimmers.
But on the bright side, I know I burn more calories per minute than
either of them.
Does anybody have any explanations for what makes us floaters or
sinkers? Body fat? Bone density? Eye color?
Also, are there any good tips for turning a sinker into a good
swimmer?
I'm sure some of you have accomplished this.

Getting good at anything is usually a matter of two things - instruction
and practice. Take a class or some private lessons, and practice what
you're taught. Unless you have some underlying health issues we don't
know about, that's all that's required - instruction, practice, and
patience. Swimming is more technique dependent than bicycling or
running, and many cyclists and runners find learning to swim frustrating
for that reason, but I assure you it can be done. I didn't learn to
swim until my late 20's but do just fine now, and if I can do it, anyone
can do it.

-S-

[rtk]

If you go to:
http://swimming.about.com/
and click on Swimming for Newbies, you'll find all sorts of
good suggestions.
There are other pages there about floaters and sinkers and
probably even fat/bone density/eye color/

rtk

[Steve Freides]

Post by rtk
http://swimming.about.com/
and click on Swimming for Newbies, you'll find all sorts of good
suggestions.

For me, my swimming never really went anywhere until I took lessons. I
learned how to swim, alright, but I took a 30 minute one-on-one lesson
for most of a year once, and it made a _huge_ difference.

-S-

[hometown ambiguity]

In article <***@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com>, ***@hotmail.com wrote:
[snip] >wife) uses basically the same technique as I do. The difference is, she

Post by H***@hotmail.com
can float with almost no effort. I can't seem to float no matter how

[snip] >1. Good swimmers. These people use good technique and can probably be

Post by H***@hotmail.com
either natural floaters or natural sinkers.
2. Floaters. These people have virtually no technique, yet somehow can
swim with ease and not tire.
3. Sinkers. These people have no technique and can only stay afloat for
minutes at a time before all of their energy is expended.
As a sinker, I do sometimes feel jealous of floaters and good swimmers.

[snip]

i also can't float. even with my lungs full, my legs still sink & slowly my
body becomes vertical in water. i have to move minimally in order to
stay afloat horizontally.
i think technique is more important for us.
i'm still struggling with technique. taking lessons did help me.

bye now

==========
Pam @ Home

Cort Furniture Rental and Honesty are two mutually exclusive concepts.

[Silver0l]

Post by H***@hotmail.com
As a sinker, I do sometimes feel jealous of floaters and good swimmers.

Those sinker / floater stories always sound to me like excuses for poor
technique.
Not to say that everybody has the same density, but with proper technique,
high density is not a problem.

-- Olivier

[Michael Edey]

Post by Silver0l

Post by H***@hotmail.com
As a sinker, I do sometimes feel jealous of floaters and good swimmers.

Those sinker / floater stories always sound to me like excuses for poor
technique.
Not to say that everybody has the same density, but with proper technique,
high density is not a problem.
-- Olivier

I don't float at all. Not even a little bit. As - becomes completely
immersed and in full contact with the bottom in a visibly short period of
time.

Perhaps, as a consequence, I've got a high 'stalling speed' and never
really learned to swim well at sub aerobic speeds. Thank god for sprints.
Oh and the now bastardized underwater dolphin ;)

--Mike

[e***@broadcom.com]

Post by H***@hotmail.com
While on vacation not too long ago, I decided to try to learn to swim
properly. (I currently only know the doggy-paddle stoke which wastes a
great deal of energy.) What surprised me is that my instructor (my
wife) uses basically the same technique as I do. The difference is, she
can float with almost no effort. I can't seem to float no matter how
hard I try. So even though neither of us swims properly, she can easily
swim around the pool without tiring. I take several breaks and am
always out of breath.
So I studied other swimmers and came to the conclusion that there are 3
1. Good swimmers. These people use good technique and can probably be
either natural floaters or natural sinkers.
2. Floaters. These people have virtually no technique, yet somehow can
swim with ease and not tire.
3. Sinkers. These people have no technique and can only stay afloat for
minutes at a time before all of their energy is expended.
As a sinker, I do sometimes feel jealous of floaters and good swimmers.
But on the bright side, I know I burn more calories per minute than
either of them.
Does anybody have any explanations for what makes us floaters or
sinkers? Body fat? Bone density? Eye color?
Also, are there any good tips for turning a sinker into a good swimmer?
I'm sure some of you have accomplished this.

USA swimming does test their atheletes for buoyancy. They put them on
the bottom of the pool with a lung full of air and see what happens.
Many start to go to the surface - one guy didn't budge. So they
reasoned that he would only make a great sprinter, as this person also
had tremendous leg strength. Not sure if there is anything to that -
I'm not a big fan of usa-swimming.

I used to do the old TI "shark fin" drill whereby you kick in a side
lying, balance position with your face in the water, and then bring
your recovering arm up and hold it like a fin abvove your side. Some
people can do this and stay on the surface. Not me. I held this
position long enough one time to actually bounce off the bottom of the
pool, which was 7 feet deep.

By I get paranoid about my buoyancy, or lack of it, too. I think I
feel that my body is going through the water a couple inches below the
surface farther than it should. This wouldn't be a problem, except we
have to breath. And getting to the surface to breath can cause body
contortions. But I suspect my buoyancy is average, like everything
else.

Most all of this has to do with talent and fitness. Ever start a
workout by swimming powerfully through the water on the first repeats?
Your body feels elevated in the water, breathing is easy, and you are
carrying a lot of speed. (for yourself, anyways) I think our brains
have it figured out - a certain amount of your pulling and kicking is
actually elevating your body in the water a bit, and not directly
taking you down the pool. And that pays HUGE dividends in terms of
speed since water is so dense. But within a few laps, this energy
output is too much and you start feeling like that big bowed ship
trying to drive through the water. I think your brain is pretty good
at figuring out how much body elevation pays dividends compared to
speed. It's just that we're not elites and it's tough to maintain that
for a long time.

But look at any elite swim video - they are all riding high in the
water, and I have to believe they don't float any better than the rest
of us.

Eric

[rtk]

How often have I heard a conversation like this:

Young buck entering pool states proudly *I'm a sinker* and
suggests it's because of the extreme denisty of his bulging
muscles.
Response: If you had more vital capacity (lung power) of
course you wouldn't sink.
Sudden denial of being that much of a sinker.
Also, if you had any swimming skill, you'd be up there. And
if you had any momentum, you'd be...well, you get the idea.
Young sinker is a sinker no more, at least won't admit it.
It is a misinformed bragging point.

rtk

[Pat in TX]

Post by rtk
Young buck entering pool states proudly *I'm a sinker* and
suggests it's because of the extreme denisty of his bulging muscles.
Response: If you had more vital capacity (lung power) of course you
wouldn't sink.
Sudden denial of being that much of a sinker.
Also, if you had any swimming skill, you'd be up there. And if you had
any momentum, you'd be...well, you get the idea.
Young sinker is a sinker no more, at least won't admit it. It is a
misinformed bragging point.
rtk

Do you think that not trusting the water to keep one afloat may have an
effect? I do. The sinkers I have talked to are all extremely tense around
water. They simply do not trust it at all, even when I point out that if
they push down on the water, their body will go upwards. They try to float
with their muscles so tense and their bodies bent as if they were sitting in
a chair instead of relaxing.

Pat in Tx

[rtk]

Post by Pat in TX
Do you think that not trusting the water to keep one afloat may have an
effect? I do. The sinkers I have talked to are all extremely tense around
water. They simply do not trust it at all, even when I point out that if
they push down on the water, their body will go upwards. They try to float
with their muscles so tense and their bodies bent as if they were sitting in
a chair instead of relaxing.
Pat in Tx

At the very least, a tensed muscle is a shorter one, so
there is certainly less surface area to float on. It could
also be a misunderstanding of what floating is. Nobody has
toes out of the water while they *float.* It's inflated
lungs up and the rest sliding down until the deflated lungs
go down also. I'm certainly no floater, but I swim very
high. I find the whole concern a bit nutty. Nobody gets
anywhere trying to float, so why not just accept the fact
that swimming is not done above water and get on with it.
Well, part of the reason does seem to be to me the idea that
being a sinker is an indication of dense body, so it's worth
bragging about.

rtk

[m***@privacy.net]

On 8 Jun,

Post by Pat in TX
Do you think that not trusting the water to keep one afloat may have an
effect? I do. The sinkers I have talked to are all extremely tense around
water. They simply do not trust it at all, even when I point out that if
they push down on the water, their body will go upwards. They try to
float with their muscles so tense and their bodies bent as if they were
sitting in a chair instead of relaxing.
Pat in Tx

At the very least, a tensed muscle is a shorter one, so there is certainly
less surface area to float on. It could also be a misunderstanding of
what floating is. Nobody has toes out of the water while they *float.*
It's inflated lungs up and the rest sliding down until the deflated lungs
go down also. I'm certainly no floater, but I swim very high. I find the
whole concern a bit nutty. Nobody gets anywhere trying to float, so why
not just accept the fact that swimming is not done above water and get on
with it. Well, part of the reason does seem to be to me the idea that
being a sinker is an indication of dense body, so it's worth bragging
about.

I have come across many self admitted 'sinkers' in my teaching of swimming.
I've been able to convince them all that they can float motionless in the
water. It's just a matter of getting them to relax (the harder part) and to
fill their lungs with air. I /have/ come across some (floaters) that I can't
persuade to sink.

[Pat in TX]

At the very least, a tensed muscle is a shorter one, so there is certainly
less surface area to float on. It could also be a misunderstanding of
what floating is. Nobody has toes out of the water while they *float.*
It's inflated lungs up and the rest sliding down until the deflated lungs
go down also. I'm certainly no floater, but I swim very high. I find the
whole concern a bit nutty. Nobody gets anywhere trying to float, so why
not just accept the fact that swimming is not done above water and get on
with it. Well, part of the reason does seem to be to me the idea that
being a sinker is an indication of dense body, so it's worth bragging
about.
rtk

I sense a claim here of "it's not MY fault--I can't help it if I just can't
float!" behind the original poster's writings. Also, maybe a bit of "Well, I
tried, but my body just isn't made that way." So that he can quit trying and
if anyone asks about his swimming, he can just say, "Not my fault."

Pat

[b***@yahoo.com]

Post by H***@hotmail.com
Does anybody have any explanations for what makes us floaters or
sinkers? Body fat? Bone density? Eye color?

Body fat, we have some outstanding 350 lb "human bobbers" at our pool,
they just jump in and casually "walk" back and forth across the deep
end of the pool. They never get their hair wet. If you threw them in
the middle of the ocean they probably could survive a few weeks without
much problems....

[didgerman]

Post by H***@hotmail.com
While on vacation not too long ago, I decided to try to learn to swim
properly. (I currently only know the doggy-paddle stoke which wastes a
great deal of energy.) What surprised me is that my instructor (my
wife) uses basically the same technique as I do. The difference is, she
can float with almost no effort. I can't seem to float no matter how
hard I try. So even though neither of us swims properly, she can easily
swim around the pool without tiring. I take several breaks and am
always out of breath.
So I studied other swimmers and came to the conclusion that there are 3
1. Good swimmers. These people use good technique and can probably be
either natural floaters or natural sinkers.
2. Floaters. These people have virtually no technique, yet somehow can
swim with ease and not tire.
3. Sinkers. These people have no technique and can only stay afloat for
minutes at a time before all of their energy is expended.
As a sinker, I do sometimes feel jealous of floaters and good swimmers.
But on the bright side, I know I burn more calories per minute than
either of them.
Does anybody have any explanations for what makes us floaters or
sinkers? Body fat? Bone density? Eye color?
Also, are there any good tips for turning a sinker into a good swimmer?
I'm sure some of you have accomplished this.

It doesn't matter if you're a floater or sinker. Once you're swimming
it's all the same.
A world record holder told me that, so I think it's pretty safe to agree
with him....

[JJ]

I am certain there IS a biological case for some people being more bouyant
then others. Fat floats and dense muscal and bone doesn't float so well
(although I am sure there are lots of other factors too).

Here is a good example.

Next time the Olympics are on, look how many black people are swimming in
the finals. Then look at the athletics track and see how many black people
are scoring golds here. Black people tend to have a body frame much more
suited to track sports than swimming - clearly there are exceptions but
afro-caribean people on average have a greater muscle density than caucasian
people and I am sure there are variations in other races throughout Asia and
Europe too. If this is the case, then I am also sure there are lots of other
genetic factors that would pre-dispose a person to be better at floating
than somebody else who may be better at other sports.

I myself carry a bit too much body fat (and don't run at all well), but I
float easily and usually feel as though I could swim for ever if I had to.I
have a friend who is the same height/weight but carries little fat. He can
run all day but goes purple if he has to make a length - and am pretty sure
this isn't all technique.

J

Post by H***@hotmail.com
While on vacation not too long ago, I decided to try to learn to swim
properly. (I currently only know the doggy-paddle stoke which wastes a
great deal of energy.) What surprised me is that my instructor (my
wife) uses basically the same technique as I do. The difference is, she
can float with almost no effort. I can't seem to float no matter how
hard I try. So even though neither of us swims properly, she can easily
swim around the pool without tiring. I take several breaks and am
always out of breath.
So I studied other swimmers and came to the conclusion that there are 3
1. Good swimmers. These people use good technique and can probably be
either natural floaters or natural sinkers.
2. Floaters. These people have virtually no technique, yet somehow can
swim with ease and not tire.
3. Sinkers. These people have no technique and can only stay afloat for
minutes at a time before all of their energy is expended.
As a sinker, I do sometimes feel jealous of floaters and good swimmers.
But on the bright side, I know I burn more calories per minute than
either of them.
Does anybody have any explanations for what makes us floaters or
sinkers? Body fat? Bone density? Eye color?
Also, are there any good tips for turning a sinker into a good swimmer?
I'm sure some of you have accomplished this.

[rtk]

Post by JJ
I am certain there IS a biological case for some people being more bouyant
then others. Fat floats and dense muscal and bone doesn't float so well
(although I am sure there are lots of other factors too).

The sport is called swimming. There are four strokes, no
floating.

rtk

[JJ]

Your point being?

Post by JJ
I am certain there IS a biological case for some people being more
bouyant then others. Fat floats and dense muscal and bone doesn't float
so well (although I am sure there are lots of other factors too).

The sport is called swimming. There are four strokes, no floating.
rtk

[rtk]

Post by JJ
Your point being?

Why waste the time and worry about something so useless.
Who goes to the pool or ocean just to float around? But if
you do, there are boards to lie on so you don't have to go
get fat or something just to stare at the ceiling or sun.
Swimmers don't sink, fat or skinny. There's not even a
sense of danger of doing so. Simply swim and the whole
problem is solved. If your vital capacity is all that
small, swimming will help.

rtk

Post by JJ

Post by JJ
I am certain there IS a biological case for some people being more
bouyant then others. Fat floats and dense muscal and bone doesn't float
so well (although I am sure there are lots of other factors too).

The sport is called swimming. There are four strokes, no floating.
rtk

[Michael Edey]

Post by rtk

Post by JJ
Your point being?

Why waste the time and worry about something so useless.
Who goes to the pool or ocean just to float around? But if
you do, there are boards to lie on so you don't have to go
get fat or something just to stare at the ceiling or sun.
Swimmers don't sink, fat or skinny. There's not even a
sense of danger of doing so. Simply swim and the whole
problem is solved. If your vital capacity is all that
small, swimming will help.
rtk

We worry about floating or, more specifically, body position for the same
reason why cyclics trim grams off their bikes, golfers experiment with
exotic shaft materials and open water swimmers complain about (wait for
it) wetsuits.

Small differences are the whole game at the elite level and are hardly to
be scoffed at at the rec level. Something that becomes a little more
evident if bouyancy is considered as a spectrum and not a boolean.

--Mike

[rtk]

Post by Michael Edey
Small differences are the whole game at the elite level and are hardly to
be scoffed at at the rec level. Something that becomes a little more
evident if bouyancy is considered as a spectrum and not a boolean.
--Mike

In fact, is buoyancy a factor among elite swimmers?
Statistically, has anyone noted if Olympic gold medalists
float better than silver? It's an interesting point and I
haven't a clue. But usually the question about floating is
not brought up by elite swimmers, at least not within my
hearing. I have often heard it asked by bicyclists new to
the sport of swimming who may be looking for a flattering
reason why they sink. Heavy muscles? Poor technique?

rtk

[rookie]

Post by rtk

Post by Michael Edey
Small differences are the whole game at the elite level and are hardly to
be scoffed at at the rec level. Something that becomes a little more
evident if bouyancy is considered as a spectrum and not a boolean.
--Mike

In fact, is buoyancy a factor among elite swimmers?
Statistically, has anyone noted if Olympic gold medalists
float better than silver? It's an interesting point and I
haven't a clue. But usually the question about floating is
not brought up by elite swimmers, at least not within my
hearing. I have often heard it asked by bicyclists new to
the sport of swimming who may be looking for a flattering
reason why they sink. Heavy muscles? Poor technique?
rtk

I have no idea if there is any difference in how well Olympic swimmers
float. I suspect very little.

Where I believe natural 'floaters' (for want of a better term) have an
advantage is in learning to swim. If you are naturally quite buoyant
(be it down to bodyfat ratios, genetics, bone density or any other
factor) then you are likely to feel much more comfortable in the water
so the properties of a good swimming stroke - relaxation, precision,
balance - will come much more easily. There's no reason why somebody
who is naturally more prone to sink can't eventually learn good swim
technique and go just as fast - it's just that many of them are put off
from an early age because they are too busy trying to stay afloat and
breath to worry about technique. It also means that at school
'floaters' are more likely to be identified as natural swimmers and
given more coaching.

My swim coach reckons that I do float but that when I'm stationary in
the water and holding my breath, around 98-99% of me is submerged. The
challenge therefore is to go fast enough to get a bit more of me out of
the water and to balance well enough that the bit of me that does come
out of the water includes my mouth so I can breath without lifting my
head. She reckons some of her other swimmers are more like 85-90%
submerged - so breathing is much less of a worry.

An analogy is like learning to ride a bike with or without stabilisers
- you can do it either way, but without stabilisers is a hell of a lot
harder.

[rtk]

Post by rookie
Where I believe natural 'floaters' (for want of a better term) have an
advantage is in learning to swim. If you are naturally quite buoyant
(be it down to bodyfat ratios, genetics, bone density or any other
factor) then you are likely to feel much more comfortable in the water
so the properties of a good swimming stroke - relaxation, precision,
balance - will come much more easily. There's no reason why somebody
who is naturally more prone to sink can't eventually learn good swim
technique and go just as fast - it's just that many of them are put off
from an early age because they are too busy trying to stay afloat and
breath to worry about technique. It also means that at school
'floaters' are more likely to be identified as natural swimmers and
given more coaching.
An analogy is like learning to ride a bike with or without stabilisers
- you can do it either way, but without stabilisers is a hell of a lot
harder.

First of all, the bike. Go out with a kid, run yourself
ragged so they don't fall. On that same day, they learn to
ride their two-wheeler. Give the child the extra two wheels
and then struggle with them for a year to have the courage
to do without. Much easier without the training wheels.
Even without the running parent, it only takes a few gentle
tumbles.

Learning to swim if you're not a floater: the natural way.
First trying to sit on the bottom of either the shallow
end of the pool or three feet in the open water. Then
trying to pick up something from the bottom. Marco Polo
sort of games. In other words, getting to know the water
from the bottom up. When it's time to learn to swim,
there's no feeling of desperate need to stay above the
water. You swim IN the water. Only fear causes someone to
try the impossible. Even the most buoyant of swimmers don't
try to stay on top.

rtk

[rookie]

Post by rtk

Post by rookie
Where I believe natural 'floaters' (for want of a better term) have an
advantage is in learning to swim. If you are naturally quite buoyant
(be it down to bodyfat ratios, genetics, bone density or any other
factor) then you are likely to feel much more comfortable in the water
so the properties of a good swimming stroke - relaxation, precision,
balance - will come much more easily. There's no reason why somebody
who is naturally more prone to sink can't eventually learn good swim
technique and go just as fast - it's just that many of them are put off
from an early age because they are too busy trying to stay afloat and
breath to worry about technique. It also means that at school
'floaters' are more likely to be identified as natural swimmers and
given more coaching.
An analogy is like learning to ride a bike with or without stabilisers
- you can do it either way, but without stabilisers is a hell of a lot
harder.

First of all, the bike. Go out with a kid, run yourself
ragged so they don't fall. On that same day, they learn to
ride their two-wheeler. Give the child the extra two wheels
and then struggle with them for a year to have the courage
to do without. Much easier without the training wheels.
Even without the running parent, it only takes a few gentle
tumbles.

OK, maybe not a great analogy. Don't have much experience of teaching
kids to ride bikes.

Post by rtk
Learning to swim if you're not a floater: the natural way.
First trying to sit on the bottom of either the shallow
end of the pool or three feet in the open water. Then
trying to pick up something from the bottom. Marco Polo
sort of games. In other words, getting to know the water
from the bottom up. When it's time to learn to swim,
there's no feeling of desperate need to stay above the
water. You swim IN the water. Only fear causes someone to
try the impossible. Even the most buoyant of swimmers don't
try to stay on top.

You swim IN the water, but to do crawl successfully you need to get
your mouth OUT of the water. Breaststroke is fine - your whole upper
body comes out of the water so you can breath. I have always been fine
doing breaststroke or swimming underwater with my breath held. But I
have always struggled with front crawl because it is very difficult for
me to breath unless I am swimming with very good technique. And it is
very difficult to learn very good technique when you can't breath. The
better you float the easier it is.

Maybe if you're taught properly at an early age when you learn things
more easily then it's OK. But most people aren't, and if you're trying
to learn good front crawl as an adult 'sinker' then I can tell you
based on my own experience and that of many others I know that it can
be extremely hard. It is also something that most natural 'floaters'
find very difficult to empathise with because it's something they've
never had to worry about too much. In particular, most female swimmers
I know simply cannot understand how difficult it can be. Women, by and
large, float far better than most men. Which almost certainly explains
why I rarely see any women at my local pool swimming anything other
than smoothly, calmly and serenely, and most of them quite quickly.
The thrashers and flounderers are invariably male.

Post by rtk
rtk

[rtk]

Recently a couple of new swimmers have come around and asked
for help. Others have noticed their heads are held
extremely high and suggested telling them to lower their
heads. I said their heads are up there because they're
fearful, really worried about water instead of air. Let's
just wait, I said, until they're more comfortable about the
whole swim idea and see if gravity doesn't solve the
problem. I only said to relax and go slow, not to kick so
much (they're runners) and simply get used to water. Six
weeks later, following a plan I put up on the net that takes
that long to swim a straight mile, their heads had gradually
come down and they were breathing in the trough their head
makes. Fears were gone and I'm sorry to say one of them is
faster than me already. Bottom line: don't push it, we're
all sufficiently lazy so that our heads come down without
much thought and we find that trough in which to breathe.
Six weeks is a magical number; everything seems to take that
long to heal or change or anything except have a baby.
Floating is really easy in that case.

rtk

[Martin Smith]

Post by rtk
Recently a couple of new swimmers have come around and asked
for help. Others have noticed their heads are held
extremely high and suggested telling them to lower their
heads. I said their heads are up there because they're
fearful, really worried about water instead of air. Let's
just wait, I said, until they're more comfortable about the
whole swim idea and see if gravity doesn't solve the
problem. I only said to relax and go slow, not to kick so
much (they're runners) and simply get used to water. Six
weeks later, following a plan I put up on the net that takes
that long to swim a straight mile, their heads had gradually
come down and they were breathing in the trough their head
makes. Fears were gone and I'm sorry to say one of them is
faster than me already. Bottom line: don't push it, we're
all sufficiently lazy so that our heads come down without
much thought and we find that trough in which to breathe.
Six weeks is a magical number; everything seems to take that
long to heal or change or anything except have a baby.
Floating is really easy in that case.
rtk

I have a soreness directly under one heel that has been around for much
longer than six weeks, and it won't go away.

[rtk]

Post by Martin Smith
I have a soreness directly under one heel that has been around for much
longer than six weeks, and it won't go away.

Have you tried the standard fox technique?

rtk

[Martin Smith]

Post by rtk

Post by Martin Smith
I have a soreness directly under one heel that has been around for much
longer than six weeks, and it won't go away.

Have you tried the standard fox technique?
rtk

I'll bight. No, what is the standard fox technique?

[rtk]

Post by Martin Smith

Post by rtk

Post by Martin Smith
I have a soreness directly under one heel that has been around for much
longer than six weeks, and it won't go away.

Have you tried the standard fox technique?
rtk

I'll bight. No, what is the standard fox technique?

Cute. Yes. Bite. As in off.

rtk

[Michael Edey]

Post by Martin Smith
I have a soreness directly under one heel that has been around for much
longer than six weeks, and it won't go away.

does sound like it'd be worth getting the foot check for bone spurs or
plantar fasciitis though.

Attempting to take care of it yourself may well end up being more than you
can chew :)

--Mike

[Martin Smith]

Post by Michael Edey

Post by Martin Smith
I have a soreness directly under one heel that has been around for much
longer than six weeks, and it won't go away.

does sound like it'd be worth getting the foot check for bone spurs or
plantar fasciitis though.
Attempting to take care of it yourself may well end up being more than you
can chew :)

The first thing I did was get an MRI. It was clean.

[Martin Smith]

Post by rtk

Post by Martin Smith

Post by rtk

Post by Martin Smith
I have a soreness directly under one heel that has been around for much
longer than six weeks, and it won't go away.

Have you tried the standard fox technique?
rtk

I'll bight. No, what is the standard fox technique?

Cute. Yes. Bite. As in off.
rtk

I get it. No, it isn't that bad, and I'm not trapped. They tell me it is
inflammation of the tendons, but the pain is directly under the back of
the heel, so it is only where the tendons attach to the bone. I can move
around ok, but if I try to do aerobics, it stops me.

[Red Speedos]

Hi everyone,

I started swimming in my mid 20s, so I'm no expert on swimming.
Regrettably, I never took swimming lessens. But I've gotten to the point
where swimming is easy. I feel like I can keep swimming forever. I swim
primary to keep myself in shape. I'm one of those guys who keep swimming
in the medium lanes. Since I'm reasonably fit (but not very muscular or
athletic), I don't think I'm categorized as a floater. But I'm not sure
if I'm a sinker.

However, it is easy only when I breath to my right. When I breath to my
left, it is very hard and I have a "sinking" feeling. My posture, body
rotation and everything else seem to be wrong. My head tends to stick
out of the water and my body tends to rotate too much to my left. I
don't have a feeling of "catching" the water with my left hand or
"skating" on the left side of my body as TI describes.

When I breath to my "normal" right side, my head is fairly low even when
I'm breathing. I seem to be creating some "breathing area" by
combination of my posture, body rotation, etc. Or maybe my body knows
exactly when to breath. My body, including my head, is fairly straight
and relaxed all the time. I don't even need to swim fast at all to do this.

So, my feeling is that technique is much more important than buoyancy.

My $2/100.

[Michael Edey]

On Mon, 26 Jun 2006 05:58:36 +0000, Red Speedos wrote:

<snip>

Post by Red Speedos
So, my feeling is that technique is much more important than buoyancy.
My $2/100.

Yup - it's just that arguing for one to the exclusion of the other is to
start with a premise based upon a false dichotomy.

--Mike